Two very different movies raise a suspiciously similar question: can a film be exhilarating and leave you strangely empty? Jett and Gareth put Marty Supreme and Eephus into conversation, looking for the difference between cinematic energy and actual nourishment. Baseball may or may not provide the answer.
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Jett Loe (00:01.358)
You know, Gareth, sometimes, sometimes Gareth, their listeners, films make you feel alive. They replicate that astonishing, visceral, crisp, wonderful nervousness, nerviness almost of existence. And one of the films we're talking about this week does that. It's also sports related.
Gareth (00:20.838)
It's a... We start as we mean to go on. It's a mystery. It's an enigma. It'll unfold as we get into this episode. Welcome to the film.
Jett Loe (00:33.39)
Then we get the theme tune. Hey there folks, thanks for listening. This is The Film Talk. We've been doing it for 20 years, so let's keep doing it for another 20 more. I'm Jet Low.
Gareth (00:45.77)
Just because you did something for 20 years doesn't mean you should do it again for another 20. That's not reason enough on its own.
Jett Loe (00:51.692)
Well, I put that in the divorce papers. So this week, dear listener, we're talking about an interesting trifecta of films, right? Because these are films, we're wondering, should you...
Gareth (00:56.123)
You do.
Gareth (01:02.728)
trifecta isn't it? a du- it's a du-fecta. D-U-E. It's a du-o-fecta. Yes. we are talking about Sugarland Express, okay. Forgive me, it is a trifecta. It is a trifecta.
Jett Loe (01:06.478)
It's a trifecta. We're talking Marty Supreme, we're talking Ephus, and we're talking Sugar Land Express, if that's my end. That's this, if you would like to talk about, because dear listener, there's an infinite amount of content out there. So we're trying to help you, trying to help you, listener, there, help you kind of narrow it down and figure out what to watch in the limited time you have. So we're talking Marty Supreme, Ephus, Sugar Land Express. Coming up episode, there's a little teaser. We call this a teaser. We'll be talking about...
Gareth (01:25.331)
Yes.
Jett Loe (01:34.55)
very interesting film, what is it, The Bone Temple, the sequel to one of those zombie pictures, which was great. Last year's Danny Boyle zombie picture was great. We got a new one, The Bone Temple. We'll talk about that next week. But let's get right into it. Gareth, tell the folks about Marty Supreme.
Gareth (01:50.013)
Marty Supreme is a film about table tennis slash ping pong player Marty, played by Timothy. And it's fast moving. It's set in about 19, set about 1952. There is a lot of table tennis in it. There's a lot of fast talking. There's lot of moving at speed and a great cast.
Jett Loe (02:02.168)
Shalom Re'em.
Gareth (02:19.012)
of cameos from people that you've seen and heard of and people that you've not seen or heard of before. And three weeks after I saw this film,
Jett Loe (02:27.82)
That doesn't qualify as a cameo though. If you have not heard or seen of them, you would not know it's a cameo.
Gareth (02:32.52)
They're still making a cameo appearance, whether you've heard of them or not. Somebody's heard of them. Somebody's heard of them. I don't have to have heard of something for it to be real. And three weeks after I've seen this film, still don't quite know what to make of it. But I believe, I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, I believe we have a clip.
Jett Loe (02:35.384)
But you wouldn't know it. Okay, all right.
Jett Loe (02:42.776)
Fair enough.
Jett Loe (02:52.814)
We do have a clip. is Timothy Chalamet as Marty's working in a shoe store and a woman comes in saying she's left some of her shoes behind or maybe it's her glasses. And this turns out, they're doing a little subterfuge here to get it loaned in the back room. Let's listen in.
And I don't know you want to see what that actress's name is. It's what's her. It's a.
Gareth (03:16.89)
yeah, yeah, let me get her name.
Jett Loe (03:21.24)
What's your name?
Gareth (03:23.654)
be sure that I'm her name it Odessa Odessa as eon let's see how you pronounce that I think it's it's good to
Jett Loe (03:25.55)
for dancing.
Jett Loe (03:29.208)
Fantastic.
Gareth (03:35.89)
or a Zion, must be a Zion.
following pronunciation here. Let's see how to pronounce Odessa.
Gareth (03:51.944)
Hmm hmm hmm.
Gareth (04:03.741)
Give me a
Jett Loe (04:04.993)
That's right.
Gareth (04:11.855)
Okay, Odessa
Jett Loe (04:14.262)
Okay, whenever you're ready.
Gareth (04:22.223)
So that is Timothy Shalome and Odessa Zion in Marty Supreme. Now, Jett, there's a moment in this film that explained it that explained it all to me. And I'm hoping it was a moment where you did one of your punch the air delight moments less of a surprise, because many of these cameo or small supporting roles, there's an.
Jett Loe (04:30.614)
Yes.
Gareth (04:47.677)
you know, a traditional opening title sequence. You see the names of all these kind of Easter egg actors before the film starts. But there's a moment where this guy shows up and it's kind of the key to what the movie is trying to be. And that is Abel Ferrara, the writer director, his most well-known film is Bad Lieutenant, the film that kind of announced him on the scene is Driller Killer. And the two of his films that are less seen, but I...
Jett Loe (05:14.807)
Ahem.
Gareth (05:15.323)
really think anybody who wants to appreciate the history of US American cinema are the funeral and the addiction. Abel Ferrara directed all those movies. He's got a reputation for kind of grimy, bleak New York ugliness and kind of a sacred redemption at the
the heart of it. I the addiction is literally a film about a vampire who's doing a PhD dissertation and doing graduate work is a metaphor for vampirism. And at the reception to mark her completion of her PhD, she literally eats everybody on her advisory panel. It is a metaphor. And so when Abel Farrar himself shows up in this film,
Jett Loe (06:00.641)
We call that a metaphor. It's a metaphor. Metaphor. Also spoilers for the addiction.
Gareth (06:08.349)
Well, that's 20 minutes into the addiction. It's not really a spoiler if it happens in the first 20 minutes, unless it's psycho. OK, so he shows up and he says, OK, this is an Abel Ferrara film with more than a $32 budget. It's very well funded and the level of craft is fantastic. I mean, it's a compelling narrative and at one level an entertaining.
Jett Loe (06:11.851)
Okay.
Gareth (06:37.787)
watch, you're also dealing with the story of something really bleak, which is someone being possessed by ego and desperate to make it who manipulates pretty much everybody in his path in order to get there and is manipulated by a lot of people to at the end of the film. I felt like what I had seen was exhilarating, but ultimately kind of empty. And as I say, in the three weeks since of
or four weeks since I've seen the film, I'm not sure if it's the emptiness of the character's life or that the film is actually less than the sum of its parts. So I've been looking forward to this conversation because I'm sure you'll have things to say about that. And I'm asking you genuinely, what do you think about this idea that it may be that the film is empty, not just the character?
Jett Loe (07:29.665)
Well, how about this? Let me posit something towards you. Because I was thinking about you when the film ended. And a question came to me that I wanted to ask you right away just as the film ended. It's an obvious thing.
And dear listener, please, I would recommend seeing Marty Supreme if you, you you kind of know what you're going to get if you've seen, this is made by one of the Safdies, they're brothers. This is made by the Safdie that was not the Safdie that played Edward Teller in Oppenheimer. It's the other Safdie. It's not the two Safdies that did good times in a...
Gareth (07:58.75)
Is that Safty B or Safty A or does that imply a hierarchy of Safties?
Jett Loe (08:03.784)
It does, which kind of makes sense, but film is a linear medium, right? B goes after A. When you watch films, they progress one frame after another. There's something there, but maybe not that much. Never get through it. Could never get through it. Good times, uncut gems. If you've seen those films, you know what you're gonna get. You're gonna get that kind of safety experience. But here's the question that came to me right after.
Gareth (08:07.623)
Yes.
Gareth (08:11.473)
Have you seen Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind? Film's not always a linear medium.
Jett Loe (08:28.094)
I watched it, Gareth, and I wanted to ask you, and again, dear listeners, if you are into the Safdie movies, you probably want to see Marty Supreme if you haven't already before you hear what I have to ask Gareth. Gareth, would the film, so I was watching it thinking, I bet Gareth is going to think this film is empty, like it doesn't, like there's no there there. It's a true story. Would the film have been better or more meaningful or less empty feeling to you, Gareth? Gary, I just called you Gary, I cut that out. Gareth.
would it have been better if Marty still had that epiphany at the end? He has an epiphany about existence, right? He sees his newborn child and he's, I would assume he's realizing there's actually other people in the world that you care about, right? So it breaks through his narcissism, breaks through his ego by seeing his child. Would the film have been better if in the previous scene he had lost the ping-pong match rather than have won it?
Gareth (09:02.407)
Mm-hmm.
Gareth (09:08.125)
Mm-hmm.
Jett Loe (09:23.072)
because he triumphs in his art. and then he has the breakthrough. What if he had lost?
Gareth (09:28.711)
Yeah, that makes sense. But ultimately I couldn't tell you if you'd asked me right now, did he win or did he lose? I don't think I would remember because I mean, that's an interesting thing about the film in itself. they're like, unlike Rocky, where I won't spoil it for anybody who hasn't seen Rocky. But if you've seen Rocky, you know whether he wins or loses the fight because actually the fight itself is the culmination.
of the story. It feels like Marty Suprema. This is not a good, this is, this is, yeah, this is not, yeah, well, it's the, and this, yes, the struggles with.
Jett Loe (09:59.285)
It's the struggle. It's the struggle that matters for Rocky, right? It's the believing in himself. And we're not talking about, wait, we're not talking about the Rocky that has the sentient robot, right? Okay, the first one.
Gareth (10:09.295)
No, no, this is the Rocky where he's struggling against his own experience of low self-esteem and dignity. Marty, yes, that's partly what's happening as well, because it's everybody's broken ego is what's underneath the desire for success as a form of lording it over other people. Success is a form of dominance rather than the fact that everybody can thrive.
So the film's not so much about that culminating match. There are so many.
heart stopping, but in an unpleasant way, things that happen through the film. And I don't think that's neither a criticism nor praise. I at times it felt like I was watching a horror film version of American Graffiti. you know, every every vignette, the scene with Pendulet in it, it's kind of terrifying. And it reminds me, it reminded me of Badlands and the scenes in the pool hall. Of course, they evoke the
the hustler. I guess, I don't know, I'm just not as excited about it as a lot of people are. And you're probably right, if he had lost the game, he'd lost the match at the end and really discovered that love matters a whole lot more than that. And in some sense, him gazing on his newborn child is the first time that you see the potential for him to act altruistically, or at least with some degree of enlightened self-interest.
that shares love with other people. Yeah, maybe I would have, maybe I'd think better of the film.
Jett Loe (11:44.491)
Well, I-
Jett Loe (11:48.385)
Well, again, it sort of occurred to me right away, I was thinking about you, because if he loses, this tells you that even though my own ego is not satisfied, there's still the potential to love others. But that's not the case with the version that we see in which his ego is satisfied. He is great. and then that gives him the space.
to love others. You people love the film because it's entertaining, right? It's tons of vignettes, it moves fast, just like one battle after another. We think about that wonderful section, midsection, one battle after another, in which Leonardo DiCaprio escapes from the bad guys. I was just about to say ice there. Escapes and meets up with...
Gareth (12:10.596)
Hmm.
Jett Loe (12:31.58)
Benicio del Toro and has all these adventures ending with him getting tasered and think about how propulsive that is and there's that similar kind of fun with editing and fun with music and fun with interconnected vignettes in Marty Supreme. So it's a really, you know, it's a fun time at the movies. I would say I don't find it scary or I didn't find it anxiety inducing as I did by the other Safdie movie, Good Times, which is really something which I think is probably the best work of these three if I'm going to compare Good Times uncut.
of Marty Supreme, and I think Good Times is absolutely fantastic. I would recommend, folks, if you don't wanna see Marty Supreme, but you will kinda wanna deal with a character on the edge, propulsively moving forward in pursuit of something that might seem superfluous or meaningless. Maybe that's just a metaphor, pim-ponging. It's such a small thing, like why invest all of humanity in the small thing? I'd recommend something similar called...
A Night in the City from 1950, British film with Richard Widmark. I think someone, maybe the director said it about him or maybe it's said in the film. I think the director may have said it later. Richard Widmark's character who is a wrestling promoter, he's promoting wrestling matches in 1950, is an artist without an art. He's doing something absurd, but he's fully into it and it has a very similar vibe. Actually, I'd recommend Richard Widmark and anything you might see him in a Sam Fuller film where he plays a pickpocket. Look that up, that's also fantastic. But anyway.
Gareth (13:27.76)
Hmm. Richard Widmark.
Jett Loe (13:56.268)
Marty Supreme, I say go see it. Is that our catchphrase now? Go see it? Don't go see it. is, we're like a 1985 low rent. Do we live like in Pittsburgh and they want to do a knockoff? Hold on. They want to do a knockoff of like Siskel and Ebert and they want to do a knockoff and they go, guys, we're going to do, we can't call it at the movies. Call it going to the movies. It'll be great. Anyway, go see it if you want to.
Gareth (13:59.33)
Easy. I know.
1995, not a bad year for movies. The killing fields.
Gareth (14:17.916)
Everyone.
You say go see it, I say maybe go see it, but a film that I say definitely go see, although you won't likely be able to go anywhere to see it other than your living room, which is a pity because this deserves to be on every screen, including IMAX across the country. I suspect Jet may differ from me in this as a film. Laboring under the unusual title of EPHUS, E-E-P-H-U-S, EPHUS.
which refers to a particular kind of, I think the word is pitch in baseball, is that what it's called? When the person throws the ball?
Jett Loe (14:57.395)
Yes, it's almost a novelty like an, it's an overhand pitch in baseball.
Gareth (15:01.564)
Is it right? And this is a film that I'm looking forward to discussing. Do you want to say anything about it before I say what I thought about it? Chad.
Jett Loe (15:15.147)
Well, I mean, this is an unusual situation to listen to. I always take Gareth seriously. It may not seem that way on the show. Gareth says, he called me up, said, Jett, you have to see Ephus. You need the Ephus experience. You need to get Ephused, as the fans of this film said. And I had heard about Ephus. I heard some people loved the Ephus. And I know it won the Belfast Film Festival Best Ensemble Cast Award. And yes.
Gareth (15:42.672)
How did it?
Jett Loe (15:44.812)
And here's the thing, dear listener, you know, we get screeners, we're critics, we get the screeners who have to pay, but I paid for EFAS, thought, slow budget film, I'm gonna pay for the EFAS, I want the EFAS experience, so I paid my, whatever it was, $4. Couldn't get through it, it lasted about five minutes, and I'll tell you why. Then I felt bad, Gareth called me, he goes, hey, did you see the EFAS? And I said, I did not, I couldn't get through it, and he convinced me, he said, here's why you gotta see the EFAS. I paid for EFAS again.
Now I feel like I'm doing a Kickstarter here. I'm supporting the filmmakers. I'm paying so much money for the EFAS. I lasted 17 minutes. And here I'm going tell you why I didn't get through it. Now here's the thing. The film could totally change or possibly what I saw was the mechanism to get you into it and the film could totally change and therefore I'm not getting the full EFAS. And mean it like, you know, in 12 Angry Men, Sidney Lumet, very famously, he got the 12 guys crowded in the room. And, you know, he did the TV version
live TV before. I don't know if he used the same technique, but in the film technique, very famously, they'll teach you this in, you know, day one on film school or cinematography class. You shot with wide open lenses, which not wide open, but wide, wide angle lenses, excuse me, very different thing. Wide angle lenses that makes the room look larger. And as the film progresses, you switch the lenses up to what's called a longer lens. So it makes people more crowded together. The room will seem smaller, right? People will seem closer together when you shoot on a longer lens. It's like if you shoot something on telephoto and you zoom in,
Compressive space. And so I'm wondering, when I watched the first few minutes of EFAS, the characters say a line, and then you can tell these are not professional actors. It's more like, it's reminding me most I've ever seen the experience of filmed community theater. Then somebody else will say a line, and then as soon as they finish, there's a beat, someone else says a line. And it comes across as, these are not actors doing community theater, right? And I watched it going, wow, I wish, like if Robert Altman had done it,
Dialogue would have been overlapping, would have been more naturalistic and I'd be more engaged and not feeling like I'm watching, you know, I kind like a student film or a first film. This is probably the person's first film is my guess. Look forward to that person's other work. But anyway, so my point with this story, mean, is maybe as Ephus goes along, as you get an Ephust, maybe the acting becomes more naturalistic and the lines overlap. So I don't know. My first thought is why is this so stilted? And I thought, oh, is it a metaphor for baseball? Because baseball, it's not like
Jett Loe (18:10.923)
soccer, right, football, in which everything is flowing, baseball, you take your turns, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. So is that a metaphor for that? Or is it just, am I just watching bad community theater? So I don't know. Gareth is gonna help convince me to try Ephes one more time. Gareth, why should I get Ephesed?
Gareth (18:28.188)
So I hear what you're saying, but I also think David Mamet's films don't feel like real life either. someone, yeah, but I mean, there's real actors in community theater too. I just didn't receive it the way you did. To go back to the start for listeners who don't know what it is, this is a film co-written and directed by a young filmmaker called Carson Lund.
Jett Loe (18:35.955)
No, but those are real actors. These people are not, this is community theater. These people are, everybody's flat. Everybody's flat in this film.
Gareth (18:58.044)
It's important to know that it's produced by a small production company called Omnis Productions. Their most well-known film came out a year or so ago. It's called Christmas Eve at Miller's Point. It's by Tyler Taramina. And these are guys who are, I guess they're all in their mid-30s. And their production company has a mission statement that says something like, the films they wanna make are,
typically films that haven't been made before about the kind of people you don't often see on film and that address, if I'm remembering correctly, that address what they call cultural decay. And I don't know.
if I would have liked EFAS as much as I did, if I hadn't already seen Christmas Eve at Miller's Point, you know there's some directors who, or some kind of vibes in cinema that teach you how to watch as it goes along. You already mentioned Robert Altman. I know a number of people who just don't like Robert Altman films and they think that that equates in their mind to Robert Altman's not a good filmmaker. That's not true. They just don't like it, right? And they maybe need a little bit of an on-ramp. Like we all need on-ramps. I've needed on-ramps to...
to kind of makes, not just make sense of certain directors, but to enjoy the experience. I the best analogy I know of in my life is a friend of mine ordered a drink at a bar once and the server brought it, put it down. He took a sip and he spat it out because it tasted so awful. tasted...
Jett Loe (20:34.634)
He got ephist.
Gareth (20:35.918)
No, no, no, he got cidered actually because the server said you don't like your cider, do you? And he said, now that I know it's not beer, it actually tastes quite good. And I think that might be what's happening. And if you were to attempt EFAS a third time, I would recommend you watch Christmas Eve at Miller's Point first.
Jett Loe (20:54.1)
Yes.
Gareth (20:57.036)
Because I actually, get the sense this is a collective of young filmmakers whose films are all gonna feel like each other. I there's a scene in Christmas Eve at Miller's Point where suddenly it becomes a slapstick comedy. There's another scene where it kind of feels like is there a supernatural element here? And there's a little bit of that in Ephus too. What Ephus, yes, the revenge of Ephus. The revenge of Ephus. So Ephus as I say, it's a name for a particular kind of a rare pitch in baseball.
Jett Loe (21:15.132)
If is to there's already they've already greenlit it.
Gareth (21:26.18)
And what we're watching is a day in the life of a couple of amateur baseball teams. They're mostly middle-aged guys. And this is the last day they're going to get to play at this park before it gets built over for a public school. You're right. They're not professional actors. One or two of them are actually quite well-known veteran professional baseball players. And so expecting the nuance of...
Daniel Autoi performance isn't appropriate in this case, but I don't, no, no, no, but I actually don't think that's what they're aiming for either. I don't think that I'm overcompensating for bad acting. The thing felt totally, it felt totally real to me in the same way that a David Mamet film feels totally real, even though the people in those films don't talk the way they do in everyday life. This is...
Jett Loe (21:59.947)
You're straw manning it. Come on, man.
Jett Loe (22:12.02)
Well, I just say one thing here?
Jett Loe (22:25.096)
I've seen, you we watch films every day in which there's not professional actors. We have non-professional actors in one battle after another. The kids are fantastic. You look at, you know, Sam Raimi's early films and, you know, only one actor out of the 10 in the movie ever has a career. But, yeah. But I've never seen a film in which so many people are so flat.
Gareth (22:37.347)
Sure, or Hirokazu Kureta's afterlife. just... Well, you haven't seen this film. You have acknowledged you haven't actually seen this film.
Jett Loe (22:49.736)
I've seen five minutes of it twice and I got to minute 17. But if you're telling me this is intentional and that I need to be led into it, then I'm absolutely, my personal pledge to you and the listeners, will try to, for the ethos trifecta, ethos me again, I will try again. Okay, can I ask you a question?
Gareth (22:51.227)
17 minutes.
Gareth (23:08.463)
I think you should watch it on the biggest screen possible in the dark and just let it be. Just let it be there. Let me say something about, yes you can. And then I do want to say something about why I like it and why I think it's actually important.
Jett Loe (23:21.052)
Of course, yes. Okay, so here's the thing. Again, because I haven't seen it all, so I'm setting myself up for, you know, buffoonery, tomfoolery and failure, right? Because perhaps these, God, that's why we do the show.
Gareth (23:33.049)
Your vulnerability is welcome here. Your vulnerability is welcome here. We need more honest vulnerability in
Jett Loe (23:41.098)
Well, know, guys, men often have problems communicating. so apparently I can't communicate well with men. So I have to create shows like this in order to have a conversation.
Gareth (23:44.118)
Mm-hmm.
EFAS is partly about men trying and failing to communicate.
Jett Loe (23:53.642)
That was very apparent even in the first five minutes. is not, subtlety is not what the film's going for. So when the film starts, we know right away this is the last game, right? Last game these people are gonna play. And then there's one character missing and maybe the rules will have to be bent slightly so that it will go on. And the umpire says no, even though it's the last game. Now this is the last game for all these people. The umpire is also a middle aged or.
Gareth (24:02.423)
no. Yes. Yes.
Gareth (24:13.199)
Yes. Yes.
Gareth (24:18.074)
Mm-hmm.
Jett Loe (24:23.559)
or older man, it was completely unbelievable that he would not bend the rules. Like if in another film, you would have a scene, let's say everyone's parking, they're all getting out to putting on their equipment. And let's say somebody is like slightly parked crooked, then that umpire character would say, hey, you can't do that, you parked this way, come on now. And that would establish this character as somebody who's a stickler for the rules. Like the umpire is who he is.
But we don't have anything like that. We just have this random character go, no, you can't do that. And it makes no sense. It tells, there's no sense of believability or community or three-dimensionality in any of these cardboard cutout characters that I only saw in the first 17 minutes. But maybe that changes. Maybe that changes later on.
Gareth (25:00.567)
man, man, that's right, because what, so what, yes, yes, yes, what if, what if, what if, and I say this with love, I say this with love, what if there's a scene later in the movie that authenticates the umpire as a stickler for the rules? What if, what if, what if, literally, what if, what if Carson Lund and his collaborators as writers and him as a director actually knows what he's doing and that there may be some delicious surprises awaiting you?
Jett Loe (25:15.739)
Okay, well this is what I'm saying. That's why I say I'm setting myself up.
Gareth (25:30.671)
Dear, Jed.
Jett Loe (25:31.027)
That is why I am going to pay again for, am gonna, that is the funniest thing you've said.
Gareth (25:34.575)
three-fists you're gonna do a three-fists
I made you laugh! I made you honestly laugh. What about that? Dear listener, take note of the time stamp.
Jett Loe (25:43.389)
That is the funniest thing.
Jett Loe (25:48.522)
It is 1035 a.m. here in the mountains of New Mexico, mountain time, January 20th. That is the funniest thing Gareth has ever said to me in our 20 years of reviewing films. I'm gonna get three-fist. I'm gonna do it, dear listeners.
Gareth (26:00.379)
It was worth it. It was worth it. So I want to tell you why I like this film. I want to tell you why I like this film. It did make me think about Robert Altman, but it's actually a lot less cynical than I experienced Robert Altman's films to be. It's set in the early 90s, probably 1991, 1992. What fascinates me about it is it makes that moment, which is only 33, 34 years ago.
Jett Loe (26:06.707)
Please.
Gareth (26:28.539)
It makes it look like ancient history. makes it look like I might as well have been watching the background players in the Colossus of Rhodes. It feels so long ago that people could spend a day doing ordinary things without the wider world encroaching upon that or interrupting that in a good way.
There's not much to be served by me saying, well, I saw it differently to you. We don't need to do the counterpoint thing. Never for a second did I feel that the acting was subpar. I wasn't really even thinking about it as acting. It has much more of a docudrama kind of feel to it. And you'll have seen in the opening credits, Frederick Wiseman, probably the most distinguished documentary filmmaker working in the English language.
although not all his films are even in English. He's a voiceover actor in this film. There's a point being made there. He's giving his imprimatur to it. Hold on. You look like you're collapsing. Are you all right? Hello?
Jett Loe (27:44.487)
Yeah, I just, we're gonna cut this out. mean, okay, just keep going on the EFAS.
Gareth (27:55.644)
Help me out. Why do you feel the need to?
Jett Loe (27:58.194)
Frederick Wise.
Gareth (28:01.293)
No, come on, be like-
Jett Loe (28:03.205)
I mean, I'll watch it again and then we'll discuss. Let me three-fizz it and then we'll get back into it. I mean, thought it was literally one of the, this is not going be in the show. mean, everybody was so bad and it was so poorly shot and even the dolly moves were poor. like, and it's just like, it wasn't intentional. Like the way that it was badly shot was not an intentional, like we're going to intentionally overexpose. It was like, no, it's because they didn't have
Gareth (28:15.129)
Sure. Sure.
Gareth (28:21.047)
so beautifully. Yeah.
Jett Loe (28:32.758)
an experienced cinematographer who knew what to do with the light. I mean, it was bad. I'm glad, Frederick Wiseman is great. Nothing against it. But anyway, I don't wanna shit on EFAS, because I'm gonna watch it again. But whenever you're ready,
Gareth (28:43.267)
Bwahahahah
Jett Loe (28:46.195)
Frederick Wise.
Gareth (28:47.547)
kind of lost the thread.
Jett Loe (28:50.761)
Frederick Wiseman, I would recommend seeing those films. And I'm gonna cut this out, Gareth. We don't have time, I'm afraid, I've got to go. We don't have time to do Sugarland Express, so I'll cut out the thing at the beginning about us talking about Sugarland Express. If you have any final thoughts about EFAS, and then we'll move on.
Gareth (29:01.883)
Okay, let me, let's, let's, let's, let's, let's recover this. I said something about him being a distinguished filmmaker and he's given his improv monitor to it.
Jett Loe (29:11.261)
Yes. Wiseman. can't go wrong with a wiseman, folks.
Gareth (29:13.357)
see how do I want to end that. We mentioned Sugarland Express at the start. Let me just say I'll do one minute on it why you should watch it.
Jett Loe (29:24.541)
I'm saying I can cut that out at the top. I'll cut out, we'll talk about Sugarland Express, because I would like to see Sugarland Express. So don't tell me about it and then I will go see it. So I'll just say Wiseman is fantastic and then you can go on from there. Wiseman can't go wrong with his films. I wish I was watching one of his pictures, but I am gonna, I'm gonna three-facet. I'm gonna do it I'm being a jerk. I'm gonna three-facet.
Gareth (29:27.043)
Okay. Okay, okay, okay. Well, alright, alright.
Gareth (29:37.125)
Okay, okay.
Gareth (29:42.491)
You should three-fist it. the end of day, I'm not going to be able to persuade you to see something that I've seen just because I've seen it. But at the end of the day, I watched this film twice in three or four days. It was what they call a good hang, I guess is what they call it.
And there's something really substantial underneath around how men try to communicate, fail to communicate with each other around the role of sport in community life in the US. And it also has something about commerce as well, which is reflected in these radio ads that you keep hearing at the end. I know you think it's poorly shot. I thought it looked beautiful, particularly when it gets dark.
And I'm just fascinated by the visceral negative reaction that you're having to it. the tagline, the old tagline for the show, the old tagline for the show used to be they agree to disagree. And that's a good thing to model. So let's agree to disagree agreeably.
Jett Loe (30:49.202)
Well, you know, we bring ourselves.
Jett Loe (30:59.048)
You know, we bring ourselves to the cinema. We can't escape that, which we are. So perhaps buried inside me, like a dark nugget of hatred regarding community theater. Maybe it goes down to, you know, when I was a kid, I played Joseph in like some sort of pageant play in grade school. And maybe I developed some sort of distaste for treading the boards then. And that is somehow...
found itself seeped out like a black, hateful tar against community theater acting that we see in EFIS.
Gareth (31:31.834)
I think you should play Joseph now. You should play Joseph today.
Jett Loe (31:36.137)
It's never too late. You know, maybe there's, I wonder if there's a community theater out here. I don't, you know, participate in those kinds of things here. And I'm here in the mountains. I wonder if there's a community theater, something I'll investigate. And my personal pledge to you, Gareth and the listeners, I will pay again for the EFAS. And I feel good I'm helping contribute to the smaller budgeted cinema. Folks, thanks for listening. We're gonna do the Bone. We're gonna do the Bone Temple.
Gareth (32:02.81)
temple.
Jett Loe (32:03.112)
In a few days, the zombie pictures, if you enjoyed listening to us, God bless you. If you do want to support us, you've got the extra bonus episodes and archive episodes from our 20 years of shows. Just go to patreon.com slash The Film Talk, or you can pay extra on the apples if you do the Apple podcast thing. And we're also on Facebook at facebook.com slash The Film Talk. Thank you so much for listening. I'm going to EFOS. Any final words, Gareth? Are you going to EFOS again too?
Gareth (32:31.534)
I'll probably EFIS at some other point. I do want to see it in a theatre, but my pledge to you is I will go see the Bone Temple despite the fact that it'll probably induce some anxiety, zombie anxiety, generally something I'm...
Gareth (32:54.874)
but I did love the last one.
Jett Loe (32:55.24)
Do you know what I realized? Maybe this show is the ephist version of a professional film critic show. Even though I used to make money out of this show and that unconscious realization is that I'm ephist in it.
Gareth (33:08.633)
Yes.
Well...
Jett Loe (33:12.008)
It's a method of preserving ego. So much like Marty Supreme, I need to...
Gareth (33:16.226)
You don't want to admit that you are at the level of an EFAS.
Jett Loe (33:21.18)
That's right. Maybe I'm not a good film critic and they're that ego. need a Marty Supri...
Gareth (33:25.174)
No, you are a good, you are a wonderful film critic and all of us are one. All of us are one. Yes, that's right. In the lath- no, yes, go ahead.
Jett Loe (33:29.722)
Award-winning film critic? I have got...
I have got to break through like Marty Supreme and some of the characters I assume in the EFAS in order to succeed at the film talk. Dear listeners, thank you so much for listening. I've been Jed Lowe.
Gareth (33:48.022)
Always good to end on a redemptive note, I've been Gareth Higgins and we'll keep talking.
Jett Loe (33:55.27)
Next, EFAS.
Jett Loe (33:59.762)
No laugh, next time.
Gareth (33:59.951)
Don't... Don't... Don't... Don't punish yourself with a threefus.